Wedding Planner Pro Files: Industry Expert Insights
CWP Society is proud to produce the "Wedding Planner Pro Files: Industry Expert Insights" podcast!
Laurie Hartwell & Krisy Thomas, award-winning Master Certified Wedding Planners and Industry Educators from the CWP Society, discuss the real lives of wedding planners and professionals, dispense business tips, and share ways you can elevate yourself and your career in the wedding industry.
Visit the CWP Society website for more information: www.cwpsociety.com
Wedding Planner Pro Files: Industry Expert Insights
Mastering Wedding Budget Conversations and How Instagram Has Impacted The Way Wedding Planners Approach Their Clients
Ever felt awkward broaching the subject of budgets with your clients? Rest easy; we're here to guide you through it with empathy and professionalism. This episode removes the same of the budget conversation, and we discuss the pros and cons of asking about it upfront. We also delve into how to educate couples about the realities of wedding planning costs while ensuring they don't feel judged or uncomfortable.
Finally, we address the elephant in the room - Instagram. Its influence on wedding planning is undeniable, but beware of pitfalls. Don't let your desire to have the perfect Instagram Feed or to get published influence your decision to take on a client due to budget restrictions. Serving our clients with authenticity and being present with them is paramount. As we wrap up this enlightening discussion, we zoom out to a broader perspective of the wedding planning industry and how it can be more inclusive and kinder. Buckle up for a deep-dive into wedding budget convos, Instagram's impact, and a more compassionate industry!
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Welcome to the Wedding Planner podcast brought to you by the Certified Wedding Planner Society. Welcome to the Wedding Planner podcast. This is our Career Support Series and it's brought to you by the Certified Wedding Planner Society. We're the world's leading wedding planner certification program and the world's largest membership of certified wedding planners. My name is Laurie Hartwell and I am the founder and CEO of the Certified Wedding Planner Society, and I'm joined by my fabulous Vice President, chrissy Thomas, who is also the owner of Southern Sparkle Weddings and Events. Hey, chrissy.
Speaker 2:Hi Laurie and hi everyone that is listening. Today, we're going to be talking about budgets and how you, as the wedding planner, can educate your couples on what they can expect to pay for their wedding. So this is a good topic.
Speaker 1:I think it's good and I think what we need to do is maybe start from the very beginning and think about when our couples are first approaching us. There are so many wedding planners that ask on their inquiry form, what their budget is. So I think you and I need to talk about some pros and cons as to whether or not this is a good idea and how this can actually hurt our wedding planners in general.
Speaker 2:I think so, and one thing that automatically pops in my head as a con is nine times out of ten, they may be just throwing a number to the wall like spaghetti and they're hoping it sticks, because as engaged couples let's be honest they're probably getting their research from Google. They're Googling their city, their state, what to expect from our wedding budget, and we know as wedding planners that the bulk of the time is the information that they're getting is more than likely not correct information. So if we are initially asking them for that budget from the very beginning, their number may not make sense because they don't know any better. And not only that. I think too, Laurie. I think this can possibly turn away couples from filling out the rest of the form.
Speaker 1:I know it would for me. I don't think I would feel really comfortable about that because, number one, I don't even know you yet. You know, chrissy, if I was looking into hiring you to be my wedding planner and you're already asking me how much money I have to spend, I'm going to feel judged a little bit. So I think that that may not be a really great first place to start. Now, I'm not saying that we shouldn't have a discussion about it. I just don't think it should happen on the online inquiry form from our website, because many times what I'm noticing is wedding planners are actually making a decision on whether or not to take that person's wedding based on the answer that is given in that particular field, on that form of what is your budget. Because if they put in something like $10,000, there are some planners that are like, well, I'm not even going to have this conversation, but it kind of goes back to what you just said they don't know they don't know and, as wedding planners, I think it's ultimately our job is to educate them.
Speaker 2:I generally feel like our job is wedding planners. Even though we're planning weddings, I feel like we're also teachers. It is our job to educate couples on the realities of wedding planning and what they can possibly expect to spend in their area. And I think asking it on the inquiry form shuts that down, where you don't get even the opportunity to educate them on it. And, like you said, lori, it's okay to ask At some point.
Speaker 2:That question does need to be asked because that's the best way for you to kind of start the planning process but build up that relationship. So when you have the conversation about money, it doesn't feel like uncomfortable, it doesn't feel weird, it doesn't feel icky for someone who, like you said, they do not know who you are. But if you're having back and forth conversation with them and they can't even get to know you a little bit better, your couples are feeling more comfortable talking with you. Then, yes, go ahead and ask them what their budget is, but don't let that number automatically turn you away from taking on their wedding, because nine times out of 10, the engaged couple has no clue how much they're really going to be have to spend on their wedding.
Speaker 1:And it kind of works on every budget level too. Chrissy, I'll tell you that I had a couple that had a very nice budget. When they first reached out to me, they told me that they had $50,000 to spend. When I asked more questions during the initial consultation, I found out that they wanted 400 people to come to the wedding and they wanted it on New Year's Eve and they wanted it down in the key. So I knew right away that $50,000 is not going to work. So I'm educating couples, no matter if they're coming to me with a really, really low budget or what sounds on paper Like it's a nice budget, but, of course, without any additional questions.
Speaker 1:I don't think it's fair to make those kinds of determinations before you even find, or at least have an opportunity to find, out, more information from them. So when I was talking to that couple and I said, well, here's the thing you're going to probably be spending more than double what you're mentioning to me now Let me kind of go into why and then that's what I was doing, chrissy, kind of what you were saying is educating them on why their budget is probably going to need to go up just on a holiday alone, getting a caterer to work and have to drive two hours from Miami to get to the location down in the keys on New Year's Eve no less. But then you add the guest count. Forget it. There's no way 50 grand is going to even come close to covering it, and they ended up spending almost $400,000.
Speaker 1:So it's not necessarily people don't have more, it's just that they don't know that they might need more. And that's where we come in. So I personally, on a completely separate note, don't feel like we as wedding planners should even determine whether or not we're willing to take on a client because of someone's budget. Do you think, chrissy, that wedding planners should only take budgets that would like get us the prettiest flowers, the best bouquets and the nicest venue? Or do you think maybe wedding planners should just take any client that comes their way, obviously vetting them and making sure that they're sane, but but you know, no matter what the budget is, do you think that we should just do our job and not always be thinking about can I get this particular wedding published?
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think what I'm seeing in our industry is everyone has this mentality of only wanting to take on these high end luxury clients, and to me that is the 1%, and you can have a few of those a year. But in reality, the everyday couple is still getting married, the couple who are working there nine to five. They are still getting married and those couples also deserve wedding planners. And you know, Lori, this brings me back to when you first got started, where and I'm going to throw you under the bus here back in what was that? 1780?
Speaker 1:Oh, my God, I keep getting, I keep getting.
Speaker 2:Wow.
Speaker 1:I just saw me Like I feel like you keep going back a century every time you bring this up. Originally it was 1921, then it was 1847. Now I'm in the 1700s. I'm like what's happening here?
Speaker 2:Okay, Lori, that started 30 years ago. She's been a part of this industry for 30 years but initially, you know, during that time period, wedding planners were really thought to kind of only be for that hiring client. And your goal is to allow and let everyone know everyone deserves a wedding planner. And I think we were on that path where everyone was realizing everyone could afford one, everyone could have one. And now I feel like we're shifting where it's like I feel like I'm seeing a shift where it's going back to only if you have this much money to spend.
Speaker 1:Right. How is that beneficial? How is this supposed to benefit our industry?
Speaker 2:Industry, exactly, it's going to benefit our industry it's. All that is going to hurt our industry is if we, as wedding planners, are not being more well-rounded and taking on clients with budgets all across the spectrum. And that's not saying that you don't have to have your quote ideal client. But to me, when I think about my personal ideal client, it actually has absolutely nothing to do with how much money they're spending on their wedding. It has everything to do with what kind of person they are, how they treat me as a wedding planner and if they're going to work with wedding professionals, that's my ideal client. So that means that I am taking on clients who have, as always, $10,000 to spend upwards to $200,000 or, you know, $500,000, whatever that looks like.
Speaker 2:I have clients who are spending it all, but it's going to make sense for what their guests count and what they're expecting. And I have been fortunate enough to have weddings featured in national publications and it's been great. That's it, it's just been great. That doesn't get me business, it doesn't. It just gives you clout, but it doesn't make you a great wedding planner. It really doesn't.
Speaker 2:This doesn't. I know wedding planners who have been featured in these huge publications and I've seen a copy of their timeline and I'm like huh.
Speaker 1:How did you make it? How did you do that? What is happening in your business right now? Yeah, I actually agree with you, and I remember, you know, yeah, I can remember back to the 1700s, when I started planning weddings. Thank you for that and I put on my my original website once. You know, I actually did get started before websites were a thing. That's yes. That is sad, and let's just step over the.
Speaker 1:When websites, though, became a thing, and I got one, one of the things that I made sure to put on there is everyone, no matter your budget, deserves to hire a month of coordinator or planner, and I wanted to make sure that everyone knew this, because I knew that I could fit into those budgets. Okay, I knew, because I was doing these weddings, and so I wanted to teach other wedding planners that why are you only looking for the ones that are going to spend? You know, at that time, let's go. We're going to go back, honestly, to the 90s, the early 90s, the big, big budgets. Back then, that was like spending 30 or 40,000. Now, that's so, but back in the early 90s, that was like, oh, that's going to be a pretty nice wedding, and then I was thinking to myself well, that's great, but why can't the people that really don't have very much money? Why can't they hire me too? My prices weren't astronomical. I've never wanted to price myself outside of what the average person can actually afford, and so I wanted to make sure that I price myself to wear. Not just the rich but the poor can also have some sort of or some level of my service. So I always said I'm going to be able to fit in your budget. I will make sure that I find a way to fit in your budget. Now, does that mean I'm going to modify a package? Absolutely, if I have to modify a package to reduce my rate so that someone can have someone there to set up for their wedding if not to coordinate or plan, but at least to set up and make sure everything is properly done so that they can have a nice day. Or maybe they want me to set up and just get everybody down the aisle and let the venue take over from there. Whatever it was, I was willing to modify things because I felt like they deserved to have someone there, if that's what they wanted. But I find today that you're right.
Speaker 1:Wedding planners, back in the day, we were fighting to be able to fit inside of the minds of the average couple. Like you can afford us. You should all have at least us on a month of basis or you know for to kind of wrap up all of those details leading up to your wedding and then executing a really beautiful day, and I feel like we were finally getting somewhere. And then, all of a sudden, that shift that you were speaking of, I would say happened about three years ago, where it's like all of these educators were coming out of the woodwork and saying here's the way to become a luxury wedding planner.
Speaker 1:I'm thinking to myself we should all be luxury wedding planners, whether they have big budgets or low budgets. I want to be a luxury planner for everybody because I'm going to give a luxury service. No matter how much someone has to spend on their overall wedding. They're spending the same on me regardless. So I think that we have to consider that. But you know, everybody has different viewpoints and I get it. I just don't think you're going to be a well-rounded wedding planner if you're only focused on one type of budget and if you're making money the top priority. I think you should always strive to make as much money as possible.
Speaker 2:And what I love to that you mentioned is that you still price yourself where, like you said, everyone could afford you. So we're not telling you to. You know, charge $200 for a month of coordination package.
Speaker 1:That's not what I'm saying.
Speaker 2:We're saying you know, stay within the averages, but if you have to modify, modify like you mentioned, like you can, where you leave earlier the other day. I love that you mentioned that, because there's a way where you can adjust your packages to reflect what the services that your client needs without sacrificing how much money you're making as a wedding planner. I love that you mentioned that.
Speaker 1:Otherwise, you're leaving money on the table, Chrissy, and so so many wedding planners are complaining like, oh, I'm just not getting them on a business that I want. It's because you're turning away business because someone is telling you that they only have 10,000, 15,000, $20,000 to spend there. You should have a package price or some set of services that can fit within that person's budget. Otherwise, you are leaving money on the table and you are not going to have the revenue in which you are craving to have. We need to have different levels of services. That way, we can reach everybody from every single budget price point. We need to just be thinking about all of that. I truly believe that we, as wedding planners, need to think less about budget. We have our pricing. We know what we are worth. Going back to you mentioning we are not suggesting that you charge $200 or even just $1,000 for your month of or wedding day management services. Everybody calls it different. I try to make sure that I am keeping it all in, but whatever your lowest actual package is that includes wedding day management services, you really need to make sure that you are getting paid exactly what you are worth and know that you are able to pay your bills. Now, once that is established, why are you turning away business?
Speaker 1:I had a couple that had a $3,000 budget to spend on their wedding and my this now is we are going to go back. This is the early 2000s. Okay, my lowest package at the time was $1,400. And they said we want you. And I said now, that is going to eat up about half of your budget. And they said we will come up with another. However much we need to come up with, but we want you.
Speaker 1:So I didn't sacrifice myself. I was willing to maybe just say I'll set up, or maybe you just need coordination services. Only if you don't want any set up, Like, what are you looking for? What do you need? But then they said no, I want the whole wedding day management package and we'll just figure out the rest. Well, I was able to only get it to wear it because they just wanted 25 people at a cute little picnic in a park.
Speaker 1:I made it all happen with only an additional $500 on top of what they you know. So it's $3,500. I made it work. Now, was that really hard? Yes, but I made it work because I told them you're going to have to make some sacrifices, especially if you're willing to pay me this much and you're wanting me to stay as close to the three grand as possible. That's going to be challenging, to say the least, but I pulled in a lot of favors for that particular couple, and so I feel like today, wedding planners are not utilizing all of their resources and tools and are judging people based on how much money they have, and they are not getting creative and resourceful on how to create wedding days for people who are not incredibly wealthy.
Speaker 2:And what I love about that story too, lori, is that you did not dismiss them. You did not make them feel small or less than because their budget was only $3,000. And I I see that. I see that in forms, I see that on social media, where people are wedding planners even are being nasty and rude about how much someone is spending on their wedding, and that is so unnecessary and it really makes me sad. And there's a way for YouTube educate clients about their budget without belittling them and without making them feel less than. Yeah, sort of called for.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about how to educate our couples. You know we'll start at the initial consultation, because that's the true time that I'm actually talking to them about their budget. I'm not asking them what their budget is on their inquiry form. I am waiting to have those conversations a little bit later. I have the real important conversations ahead of that initial consultation. For instance, who, which wedding professionals did you hire?
Speaker 1:So if you guys want to know how to vet professionals and vet couples, look at some of our previous podcasts, because we talk about alarm bells or wedding bells. That was the vetting the couples and then we talked about vetting wedding professionals. So check those out if you have not already done so. But I am asking all of those questions to me. The budget question needs to be a personal one on one conversation, not a question. I ask on a forum and not a question. I'm going to ask an email before they even have a chance to meet me and see that my intentions toward them are good. Ok, so when we're at initial consultations, I'm asking OK, so how much were you planning on spending for this? Now, chrissy, if they give you a number based, you know and you hear it and you go who? I don't think that's going to work, based on you know how many guests that they're expecting, or where they're wanting to get married, or what have you. What do you say to them?
Speaker 2:At that point I do look at those two things, like you mentioned, where they're going to have the wedding and their guest count. To me those come hand in hand. Those essentially make up their budget. It reminds me like what came first the chicken or the egg, what came first the budget or the guest count. So I let them know. You know, based off my experience as a planner in this location, and based on your guest count and the number that she gave me, I think we may need to adjust, and here's why and then kind of give them some estimates. And that's where, as the wedding planner, you're going to want to make sure that you're an expert about your wedding market and that you know the averages of every single wedding vendor in your area not every single wedding vendor, but every single vendor category. So you know the average cost of the photographers in your area, you know the average cost of the catering and bakers and rentals, so that way you can educate your clients and do so in a way where you're speaking the truth, you're speaking knowledge, but I'm doing it in a very kind and not belittling way. I'm doing it in just kind of a knowledge based tone of like okay, so on average with your guest count, this is how much my clients will typically spend on flowers. You know, we'll think about it. You've got 30 tables. We need 30 centerpieces. On average, centerpieces can be this much. You've got six bridesmaids On average bridesmaids, we can call this cost this much.
Speaker 2:And in my head you know I'm doing math that's a lie. I don't do math in my head because math is not a strong suit I do have my indidentic calculator out and I'm crunching numbers and letting them know. You know, based off your best of all this information, this is probably where your budget may more than likely be. But don't worry, when you hire me as your wedding planner, we can break this down even more, because I wanna talk to you about what your priorities are. So if you don't wanna have these huge centerpieces, but you rather have a phenomenal caterer, then we can shift your budget and make sure that your needs and your priorities are met, because not every single client and not every single couple is the same. They may have different priorities. That's where their budget can be different and be adjusted to what their needs and what their priorities are. So I let them know when you hire me. This is something that we'll discuss in full detail, but this is kind of what the average is typically look like.
Speaker 1:Right, because they may not have a huge priority for really pretty centerpieces. Maybe they already have purchased something. They already have something that they wanna put on the tables, or maybe they have a completely different idea, so that's gonna save on that budget alone. Then maybe they are thinking that a completely different way to go as far as catering is concerned. Maybe they have something different in mind than what we would have maybe chosen for them. And I think that that's really the key here, chrissy, is we as wedding planners need to kind of take ourselves out of the equation a little bit. We need to be observers, we need to be listeners and we need to help guide our couples. Rather than projecting what we think they should have and how we think that wedding should look and how much we think they should spend on any given vendor category, because when you project that onto others, is it now their wedding? Because I don't really think it is. Now it becomes our wedding. We have to step back a little bit and allow the couple to tell us what they want us to do and what kind of wedding they want us to provide. Now I'm always gonna give great suggestions and see, kind of throwing something at the wall see if it sticks, like if they're excited about it, then great, that's wonderful. But I just don't think that we as planners have the right to dictate to a couple what they shouldn't shouldn't have in regards to flowers versus just candles, or a beautiful arch versus no arch at all. Why does it matter to us? The only reason why it would matter to us is if we have in the back of our mind that every single wedding we do, we have to try and get it published. Well, now you're losing out on actually creating really beautiful relationships with your couples, because now all you care about is you and how you are going to be perceived. How about? Care enough about the couple, what it is that they want, and give them the wedding that they are looking for. Regardless of how you may or may not benefit, you already did benefit. You got paid to do the job Exactly. You got paid. If you pay me, I will give you what you want Now, not if it's gonna sacrifice my reputation.
Speaker 1:There are certain things that I'm not going to do. For instance, I'm not gonna set up in front of guests. I'm not going to be okay with a couple saying we only wanna provide seating for half of our 150 guests for dinner. No, no, we need seating for all. That's why we're not gonna have a half and half situation here. There's gonna be certain things where I'm gonna be like, okay, that's gonna affect my reputation, but if it's just the overall aesthetic, come on. Why do we have to care so much about that? Let's just give these couples what they need and what they want and back off a little bit and stop caring so much about but how am I gonna get public? So I'm not gonna be able to post anything about that.
Speaker 2:That's the biggest like how am I gonna put this? This is gonna mess up my Instagram feed. Who cares?
Speaker 1:You're like, if you're only in business because of your Instagram feed, you are not in the right business. You're not supposed to be planning wedding specifically for that purpose You're supposed to be. And I bet you, chrissy, if any wedding planner is asking themselves, why did I get into this industry in the first place, why did I wanna become a wedding planner? Almost all of them will say well, in the beginning it was just because I loved love. I wanted to help couples bring their wedding dreams to life. Okay, so when did it switch then from that? Because everybody has their own wedding dreams. Right To it has to be my wedding dream for your event. And I'm gonna be really a big stickler on how pretty everything is because I care more about my Instagram feed. It can't be about that.
Speaker 2:And I think what's happening is because of Instagram. We're playing the comparison game, where we're following all of these big publications that are featuring nothing but these high-end weddings and we're thinking, well, am I wanting to? Don't look like that, am I doing something wrong? And then we're giving. Some of our planners are getting education from educators who that's all they're preaching. So it's blurring the lines of what we should be as white entrepreneurs and what, like you said, what our initial reason was for getting in this industry.
Speaker 1:I really I really can appreciate that and I really think that we need to kind of go back in time. You know, when I first started planning events in the 1700s, there was no fix, there was no such thing as Instagram, and I felt like I was able to experience a couple's event in a completely different way. It's because I wasn't motivated by how I was going to be perceived by others. I got to be present. It's kind of like now going to a concert If you go to a concert, if you went to a concert back in the year 2000, versus going to a concert in 2023, let me tell you the main difference between those two experiences. The first experience, back in 2000, you were present, you were in the moment, you were watching the band on stage. If you're at a concert today, everybody has their phone out and they are viewing the concert through the lens of their phone, watching the band on stage, and they're not being present in that moment. And I feel like that's what's happening with weddings back in the day, for wedding planners that are not feeling as though everything has to be published and perceived. They're just there to give a service that they are being paid for and they are in the moment. They're in the present moment with that couple, versus the type of wedding planner that sees everything through the lens of Instagram and publications. I feel as though we, as an industry of wedding planners, need to move away from that and I think, right, yes, if you have an amazing wedding, sure publish it, put it all over social media, but if you have a couple that you're like, I just loved them and maybe, maybe just post a picture of you with the couple or do a couple of silly pictures with you and the couple just to have some fun, there's always a different angle you can take. If it's not like one of the prettiest weddings you've ever produced, and not because of the fault of the wedding planners, just maybe the couple didn't have a lot of money.
Speaker 1:And I'll be honest, chrissy, I've done weddings. Like I said, my lowest budget was $3,000. I've done multimillion dollar celebrity weddings. I don't care, none of it matters. I cared about the people. I cared about their experience. I wanted to provide a luxury experience, no matter how much they had to spend. They spent the same amount of money on me and that's the difference. Here they're getting paid. Why do you need more?
Speaker 1:So I think that it's important that we just stay present and stop making it about the budget, but I think it is wise to always educate your couples on the budget and they might say to you yeah, okay, so I didn't realize that it was going to cost us this much, so we may not be able to get the wedding that we were hoping for. That, by the way, right, there is an opportunity. We can take that as an opportunity and say, oh, we can still get you a fabulous wedding. It's just that now you're going to need to kind of some of my know-how and I'm still selling them on me. I you're going to need my know-how because I have given weddings where you wouldn't believe what I've pulled out before, because of my connections, because I know some tips and tricks.
Speaker 1:So I think we can still accomplish what you're looking for with the lower budget, but we're going to have to make some adjustments. Maybe we're going to need to cut a little bit of the guest list. Maybe we're going to need to get incredibly creative with this, this and this. If you're willing to do it, I am willing to be in this journey with you. Here are my fees, here are my services. Let's go through them and I can walk you through what I can do for you based on everything I now know. You should still sell yourself. I still booked almost every single wedding couple that sat in front of me because I didn't judge them on their budget. I educated them and then figured out a way that I could help them in another way.
Speaker 2:I think what sums this up for me is you, as a wedding planner. We should not let someone's budget impact the service that we provide or how we treat them. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I think that that's good advice and I think that's probably where we could even leave it, because we want to make sure that we are loving our job and remembering why we got into this career path in the first place. It's because we love love. We love events, we love providing a once in a lifetime experience for two people who have fallen in love, and it's the first day of their entire life together. That is one of the most incredible, most amazing experiences that we are paid to be a part of. Do you know what kind of crazy honor that is? That's insane. It's huge.
Speaker 1:I think what we need to do is, just as an industry, step back. Let's analyze what it is that we're doing, what our priorities are, and remember being a wedding planner is not just for the wealthy, it is for everybody. Let's be more well-rounded, let's be kinder, let's help educate our couples. Let's educate ourselves so that we understand how we can show up better at initial consultations and be less judgy of other wedding planners as well as our couples that have a little bit of a lower budget than what we've deemed is appropriate. Thank you all for listening to the Wedding Planner Podcast If you're not yet a member of the Certified Wedding Planner Society. We would love to welcome you into our amazing and loving family. You can find more information about us on our website, weddingplanarsystietycom. I hope all of you have an amazing day.
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