Trust Over Transactions: Why Ethical Vendor Relationships Matter

Certified Wedding Planner and Certified Educator, Amanda Borrero, joins CWP Society COO, Krisy Thomas, for an unfiltered conversation about one of the wedding industry’s most debated practices: kickbacks.

Together, they unpack what kickbacks really are, why they’ve become so ingrained in the wedding world, and the ethical dilemmas they create for planners and couples alike. From “pay-to-play” venue lists to referral fees passed quietly between vendors, this discussion explores how these arrangements can limit choices, raise costs, and compromise trust.

But the episode doesn’t stop there, it also offers a look at what ethical alternatives can look like. Amanda shares her perspective on building long-lasting vendor partnerships rooted in transparency and mutual respect, and how planners can negotiate perks that directly benefit their clients instead of lining their own pockets.

If you’ve ever wondered how to grow a wedding planning business built on integrity and sustainability, this conversation will leave you inspired to do things differently.

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Transcript

Speaker 1 0:00

You're listening to the Wedding Planner Profiles podcast brought to you by the CWP Society.

Speaker 2 0:16

Welcome back to the Wedding Planner Profiles, the podcast, where we dive deep into the real talk of running a wedding business with integrity, purpose and a whole lot of heart. Today's episode is one you do not want to miss, because we're talking all about the ethics of pricing and referral kickbacks in the wedding industry. Whether you're a seasoned planner or you're just starting out, this conversation will challenge you to reflect on your own business practices and relationships. Joining me again is a very special guest, amanda Barrero. She's a certified wedding planner, certified educator and owner of For the Love of Events, based in Florida. Amanda is known for her transparency, her leadership and deep understanding of vendor dynamics. Together we're unpacking everything from whatever growth kickback actually is to how these exchanges affect client trust, vendor relationships and your long-term reputation in the industry. Welcome back, amanda. I feel like you are the perfect person for this because you are all about that vendor relationship and sometimes kickbacks in the vendor relationship. Sometimes they merge and they get murky a little bit. So I'm excited for this conversation.

Speaker 1 1:25

Yeah, thanks for having me back. I'm excited too, and, like you said they, it can get a little sticky here in the wedding world, so I'm really excited that we're having this conversation today.

Speaker 2 1:33

Yeah, absolutely so. Let's start off with how we would define a referral kickback and why do you think this is such a hot button issue within our industry?

Speaker 1 1:43

Yeah, so a referral kickback essentially and normally is money in exchange for a recommendation or a referral, a paid referral essentially. So this seems to have been a common practice back in the day. I definitely still see it happening now and, while it may benefit both parties, I think we see relationships and referrals a lot differently today and we value the relationships more over the extra $100 that we may get because of a kickback.

Speaker 2 2:15

So I think what happens, amanda, with newer planners who are stepping into our industry is they're getting miseducation from other educators and who are probably who are teaching them. Well, this is how planners get paid. I think what is also happening is that planners are not only getting paid our service fee or whatever our package fee is, but we're also getting this income from our vendor referrals, and that is like double dipping and again, to me, that kind of blurs that line and I think, as planners who don't operate that way, what do you think that we should do? Or why do you believe couples understand how vendor, planner, vendor roles will work behind the scenes? Or is there a lack of transparency? Because I think some couples assume well, you must be getting paid because you're recommending this person, because of what they've seen Fort Slate online or from other wedding planners who. That's how they operate.

Speaker 1 3:08

Yeah, that's a good way to question that too. I feel like, as planners, it is our job to educate our clients as to why we are referring certain vendors. You know, as certified wedding planners, we should have an approved vendor list, and I think they need to know why we are referring somebody, especially when we're having these conversations with our clients and we're narrowing down our options that would fit best within their budget or with their vibe of the wedding, et cetera. This person we know and love that's going to take care of you, and they have this particular design service, et cetera. That's going to really match what you're looking for. They need to know it's not just I don't know that I've actually ever had a client ask me are you getting something out of this? Which I would then tell them absolutely not.

Speaker 1 3:55

This is something that we have built our list based on working with somebody. We know that they're amazing humans and they're fair and they're going to take care of you, and that's we know that they're amazing humans and they're fair and they're going to take care of you, and that's we want our clients to feel taken care of, and if it's coming from us, that's already a hot lead, if you will. So they're already going into the conversation raving that about them because we've raved about them. So they're going to say Amanda recommended me, you know, she spoke highly of you, et cetera. Um, and I I don't think that I had mentioned. You know, generally we we love working with them in quotations is not enough for clients to really get why we are suggesting to go with this particular photographer, florist, videographer, etc exactly, and I think because online couples are seeing some of this pay to play.

Speaker 2 4:43

pay to play. So I will, because and I know there are some planners in my market who that's how they operate. I mentioned it during my initial consultation because I want them to understand, because sometimes couples can view that approved vendor list as a hindrance, especially if they're already thinking well, you're recommending these people because you're getting paid to recommend these people. It's already a blurry line for them. I want them to know from the get-go.

Speaker 2 5:06

I have a Supreme Vendor List policy within my company. The phenomenal thing is no one is paid to be on my list and I don't get paid to recommend them. So I let them know that from the beginning. So that way it's crystal clear If I'm recommending these people to you, like you said before, it's because they're going to fit your style, they're going to fit your budget and this is going to be the perfect vendor for your day. That explanation, I do think, needs to be said to couples, because everything's so murky about what different planners operate. So if you're not one of those planners who have a pay to play, make that part of your pitch is that you don't do that because there's no telling who they're going to run into who doesn't.

Speaker 1 5:51

Right, wow, I guess I haven't even necessarily realized or seen so much of that like chatter between brides nowadays, so that's really that's so great for me to know as a planner, to kind of start off with that, even though that's part of our explanation anyway, like these are people we know and trust and you know go along those lines of the explanation. I've never even you know they are not paid to be on my list, so I do like that specifically you saying, especially in your area. You said you know people that do this.

Speaker 2 6:11

you may run into planners who do this. I don't operate this way, and here's why I want I don't want it to be blurry, as is Chrissy recommending me because she's getting an extra hundred dollars, or is she recommending this photographer because they're going to be a good fit for my wedding? I want to know from the beginning for sure. Now, on that note, have you ever been offered a referral fee or an assented from a dinner? And you know what's the difference for you, especially with building authentic relationships, which is what you're known for, versus falling into that pay to play.

Speaker 1 6:41

Let me get a little bit from you for that referral culture that we, yeah, yeah, so definitely, we have been approached to have some type of kickback, et cetera, multiple times, particularly when it comes to photo and video. But you know that we've we've been approached like that and while that's so nice of them to say that they want to work with us more or whatever the reason is and they would give us this in exchange, we always tell them the same thing Like we, we don't. We actually love working with you already. So typically that's what it's from, because we've already built a relationship, which is awesome. So now they already love working with us.

Speaker 1 7:19

They want to make the deal sweeter, but I always tell them hey, you know, we refer you because we love you Like, we love working with you. We know your product is amazing, your service and you're going to take care of our clients. I don't need anything from that. So with that, you know we, we appreciate it, but we don't need it. And I feel like a lot of the planners that do do that. They're like you're leaving money on the table, but I'm not because I am. I feel like people will even take a step ahead and be even more grateful for the work that we do because we're not even accepting like money.

Speaker 2 7:54

Yeah exactly one of my go-to bakers who I love. He and because I mean, even before he offered it, like we were working together on a regular basis, and he was like hey, can I offer you some referral incentive? And again saying like I don't think vendors are doing this out of like, wanting to be sneaky, they're just really grateful for the relationship we have. And in their minds it's like let me show you your, your. They're not thinking anything negative about it, and he wasn't either, but I simply I was like you're so freaking sweet, I love you and your wedding cake, You're so talented. How about this? Whatever you were going to give me, can you discount that off? And he was like done. And again, that's just an extra incentive for me selling my services of like.

Speaker 2 8:33

Part of the benefits of my approved vendor list is not only are they going to be great at their job, but they're also going to give you special Southern Sparkle discounts. And when we go to the you know Baker Tasty Key Managers, oh, this is your Southern Sparkle discount and all it does is just plant seeds. In my couple of like man, I hired the white writing planner for this plant seeds. In my couple of like man, I hired the white writing planner for this, Like, thank you for that Versus me. Just I'll take that $50, the end. I would rather it benefit my clients instead of what that's going to do. It's a domino effect. It's going to create more referrals, whether it's from their engaged friends or from that banker who adores me.

Speaker 1 9:09

It's not leaving money on the table because I'm going to consistently get referrals from them and you're making it an even more trustworthy relationship between the entire vendor team for that couple. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 9:21

Do you think that planners should be disclosing referral kickbacks to their clients? Why?

Speaker 1 9:28

or why not I'm going to say no, because we shouldn't be taking them anyways.

Speaker 2 9:34

That is a good point. That's a good point, and I think if you are a planner who is taking kickbacks and you're not disclosing this with your couples, I think that's going to be one of those things that's going to come back and haunt you in the end, I agree, and one thing so, because I think that we shouldn't be doing that.

Speaker 1 9:53

I think there is something that we should be telling our clients, which is what their benefits are. Like you said, the baker, you're going to take that $50. Well, you booked with Southern Bride, so now you I'm sorry, southern Sparkle, so now you get to get $50 off your next cake. But with us we have a florist, local bluegrass chic. That is incredible, and anytime that we refer them, our clients to them, and they book, they get a free bride bouquet, amazing, amazing. Another venue they would give us $200 as a kickback. I said I don't want to do that, but let me sweeten the deal for my clients and tell them that if they do book us, they get $200 off their ceremony fee Incredible, it's a thank you, and you're not really doing anything for it except bringing them clients, which has very much benefited me in the past and that's been awesome. Just because we already enjoy working with them the client's already booking us they're getting a discount.

Speaker 2 10:46

Right. It's like a win-win. Everyone's winning in this situation. Everyone's winning, Not just one person, Because when you think about a kickback, the only person who's winning there is the person getting the kickback. The person offering it is not getting.

Speaker 1 10:58

they're not that's coming out account. Your clients aren't getting a lick of benefit from it. So when it's this type of relationship, it's win for everyone and it's like a little reward just because you're awesome and we want to do this for you because you brought us a client.

Speaker 2 11:16

You think about planners and we're, as we're, building and creating our approved vendor list. What are some red flags that we should look out for when it comes to vendors who either want to buy their way on an approved vendor list or I know and I've talked to you about it and other educators before there are some venues popping up in Florida who are now making it mandatory that you're paid to be. You know you have a fee to be on our preferred vendor list. Can we talk through that and kind of some red flags that you see, or even how you feel about that, you know, with those venues who are that sort of that's the requirement with their, their preferred vendor list?

Speaker 1 11:51

Yeah, I mean buying your way is a red flag in my opinion, like that's just not, you know it's, it's just not ethical and um, I think one other way is flat out asking somebody like how you can be on the list and not like trying to do the work to get on that list. So if we're talking specifically about the like venues and having to pay to play, it's kind of just it's. It's really limiting for clients because one they don't know that these people are getting a kickback but they could. I have seen on invoices from these certain venues that the vendor will actually include an extra, let's say 10, because I'm going to pay to the venue. So now you're charging your client a fee that you're technically supposed to pay because you're on this list. It gets really iticky.

Speaker 2 12:44

Oh, and I can't imagine as a couple looking at that invoice and being like wait what?

Speaker 1 12:49

Yes, I have been asked that because I've I've worked with a venue that does that, but they we. There was some type of loophole that I was able to do the wedding there I probably grandfathered in.

Speaker 1 13:00

Whatever the situation was, and they asked what that extra percentage was. So now I have to sit here and explain to them. This is what it is and it's very it's like. It's literally says like venue or venue fee or whatever it was. But that's not fair to your clients that now they're taking care of that. That's your, that's your payment to the venue. That's has nothing to do with the client. You got that client because of them. So you know what I mean. It's just. But yes, it is a. I don't like the pay to play and again, it's just very limiting to the client to find someone. Yeah, it's limiting to the client to find someone that they mesh with. Well, because they're limited to this amount of people to choose from. What if they don't like anybody? What if none of the photographers are their style? What if the rental companies don't offer what they need?

Speaker 2 13:45

You know, it's just having to pay 10% extra just to cover the fact that I'm using this vendor who you're technically making me use. Exactly, it's just so, it's, it's just so murky, yeah. Yeah, you know, for newer planners who are working on building their vendor list, what's your advice for keeping the process of building that list ethical and also aligned with your values?

Speaker 1 14:07

Yeah, that's one of my favorite things. I love talking to new planners because, of course, we've all been there, and so that was one of my favorite things as I was starting to build. My business was hitting the ground. Old school meeting with people face to face. I can't like stress it enough Face to face is so important. Like that is how you build a relationship. You don't know somebody because you stalk them online. I'm so sorry. Like that's just not. You can get to know them. But let's be so honest. Like online is a is a highlight reel. I was going to say online is the best of the best.

Speaker 2 14:39

Like you're not going to see that they are impatient on wedding day All of those things you're not going to see.

Speaker 1 14:47

Yeah, and that's so. With new planners, the way that that I did it obviously through CWP's knowledge and my, my expertise there and bringing that into my, my career is being able to do style shoots. And again, feet to the ground. Um, with style shoots you really get to see how people react on an event day, even though it's a little more casual and not as strict and all the things pressure as a wedding day. But at least you get to know people, you get to see how they work, you get to see their process beforehand, their communication style, all the different things that you want to. Really, it's like a trial period for these. You're vetting these vendors so that way you can slowly start building your list and then, once you do start having these events, then you can add on as you see these other incredible vendors. So, and also the other thing too, is give before taking. So always offer before you're jumping in saying right away.

Speaker 1 15:45

I've had countless emails and DMS. We're new in the area, we want to be on your list. What do you mean? I don't even know. You Like that's crazy to just jump the gun and just flat out ask that without trying to build a relationship with a venue, a vendor, whoever it may be, so offering your services to them. What can I do to help you? Because if you want, if they want to be on your vendor list or vice versa you're asking a venue to be on their list or you're you have an eye on a venue. They need to see how you're going to work. They need to see how you're taking care of the clients as well.

Speaker 2 16:17

And I think wedding pros, when they do reach out to wedding pros, or if wedding planners are reaching out to the venues, they don't. I think sometimes that we forget that. What by me recommending you to a couple for a day that we cannot do over? That is me putting my star next to your star, because you're going to be a reflection of me. So it takes a whole lot more than a pretty Instagram grid for me to be like well, let me add you to my vendor list. If you mess up, if you are awful to work with and the other vendors hate you and the venues like gosh, this DJ is horrible, or the guests experience that, or, worse, my couple experiences that. Who is everyone looking to the person who recommended you?

Speaker 2 16:59

So it does take so much more than just that initial email or DM and hey, can I get on your list. It's a relationship. It takes that time, it takes that building, it takes a lot of trust If you're on my vendor list, if that means I trust you to take care of my clients. And again, a day we can't do over. So because of that, because the stakes are so incredibly high, it takes a lot of relationship building to get on someone's approved vendor list.

Speaker 2 17:26

So for planners who are listening and that's their goal is, to get on a proven list with a venue, it's going to take some work. It's. It's not going to take you showing up with starbucks and touring the venues basically like, and now I'm on their list, oh yeah. No, they're going to want to see you in action, they're going to want to see what a team player you are. And for those pros who, who are listening, who wants to be on vendors list, it's going to take a lot more than just offering us a hundred dollars Like, no, that's not going to work for us, we don't take it anyway. But again, it takes that trust and that building that's going to happen in order for us to recommend you to our clients. Yep, agreed. So how does ethical decision-making around referrals actually impact a planner's long-term relationship or reputation, excuse me, but also long-term vendor relationships?

Speaker 1 18:12

Yeah, this again one of my favorite things, because I feel like I've had such a great relationship with so many of my vendors since I've started in 2018.

Speaker 1 18:22

But it really is building the trust because not only can now you've been a business let's say you've been a business for five years you've worked with a handful of the same vendors because they know and trust you and it's going to be a great day. Your clients will keep on coming because your referrals keep on coming from the same core people. I just had a meeting today and the florist was like you know, every anytime I send your client to you guys, to your team, I know they're in good hands. I don't have to worry about a timeline, I don't have to worry about this, I don't have to worry about that, and that is so positive for me to hear because that means, since I started my business to now, we have just continued that trust and referral process this whole time because of how we've shown up. And again, it just makes us so much more reputable in the industry when you have that trust and all these good things flowing out of all these vendors that you work with.

Speaker 2 19:14

And again, it's long-term, it's actually, it's sustainable success. I think, when you're doing the play to pay, I don't think that's going to be long-term. I think eventually that's going to fizzle out, that's going to burn out compared to you actually establishing relationships. That is what's going to be, you know, making you a very successful wedding planner.

Speaker 1 19:33

I love that you said that sustainable success.

Speaker 2 19:35

Yeah, I think that's. That's the key, I think, for cause I really do look at referral fees as like a quick, almost gimmicky, like it's transactional. It's not, it's not exactly exactly. Amanda. Now, if you could wave a magic wand and change one thing about the way that the wedding industry handles referrals, what would it be?

Speaker 1 19:55

Yes, so you kind of touched on it earlier. But, seriously, having the vendors that we refer stay consistent throughout the process. So I feel that sometimes and you know, when we're referring you, you are an extension of me. Like you said, you are an extension of us. We're putting our star next to yours. Everything reflects back on us.

Speaker 1 20:15

So if you are on our list and mess up, we are also going to look bad. So it's really hard to have to justify somebody's actions when we're the ones who referred them. And unfortunately, we've had a situation like this that with a florist that we've had to take off our list because the consistency wasn't there. Just because it's a client that was referred by us doesn't mean you should lack communication or show up late, or you know, it's a really, really, really thin line and because we want our reputation to stay intact and be and we want to refer incredible people that stay committed to what they say, um, then you know we have to evaluate our list all the time to make sure, hey, is this person taking care of our clients the way that they always have, or do we need to reevaluate and remove some people? So yeah, it's hard, it's really hard and you are on our list.

Speaker 2 21:09

there are friends, you know, and we talked about during one of our previous podcast episodes, about how sometimes, because we become so close with our wedding pros, that line of friendship and professionalism can blur and they can start to slip up or just be a little lax, a daisy with some things.

Speaker 2 21:30

It's like oh, it's just, chrissy, like you said, I can wait a few days to respond back to this email. It's like no, I'm, I need you to respond back now, like so it does for sure. I think, and I think sometimes it does have to do with us maybe having the conversation of like I love you, I want to keep working with, but these are some things you've noticed and they may not even realize it, because they're like well, you're my friend, I love you. That's why I can, you know, slip up a little bit now Because, again, like you said, they're an extension of us. So, even if you are the best of friends, if you start slipping with things that impact my clients and my reputation in this industry, I'll still be your friend, but I can't recommend you until you get your life together.

Speaker 1 22:12

It's so hard because you don't want to have that conversation, but at the end of the day, if somebody you're consistently doing business with, you do have to have that conversation.

Speaker 2 22:23

I've been there before with some of my favorite people and I'm like what's happening? I love you, I want to work with you. Let's figure this out Well, amanda, thank you so much. What an incredible and thought provoking conversation with you. As planners, we hold a responsibility not only to our clients but to the integrity of the wedding industry itself. Navigating vendor relationships and referrals with honesty and intention isn't just good business, but it's how we build trust, foster genuine partnerships and also protect our reputation long-term. Whether you faced the gray areas of kickbacks before or this is a brand new conversation for you, I hope today's episode encouraged you to examine your own practices and recommit to ethical decision making. Amanda, thank you again for sharing your wisdom and your expertise, but also your heart, and if you want to learn more about the CWP Society, our memberships and the certifications we offer, including our Executive Certified Wedding Planner Program, head over to cwpsocietycom. Whether you're just starting out or looking to elevate your planning business with ongoing education and a strong professional community, we would love to support you. Thanks, amanda.